CuriousCat Archive Page 92 of 202

  1. What do you think about Noam Chomsky's denial of the Bosnian genocide?

    wait, is that what he said? did he deny the genocide? I thought he said it was horrible but disagree that the word "genocide" was applicable.

    these are both bad positions, but the former is a lot worse.

  2. What's some short but sweet t h e o r y? I got a copy of Understanding Power by Noam Chomsky, does that work?

    Specifically, I need some intro level baby shit, my current brand of Leftism is an abusive parasocial relationship to Left Twitter held together by catholic guilt and fear of being shunned by people who do not know me, along with The Shock Doctrine, weekly John Oliver and half-remembered Philosophy Tube/Contrapoints/Hbomberguy videos- I need something actually concrete before this house of cards collapses and I subscribe to the Financial Times.

    I suppose if you want short and impactful you could go with Capitalist Realism by Mark Fisher, though I have to cop to the fact that I haven't finished it. Orwell's The Lion and the Unicorn was formative for me, and, while longish for an essay, it's quite short compared to, like... the Communist Manifesto.

    I'm trying to figure if I've read much I'd call "theory." I'm not sure I have!

  3. I’m just trying to say from the perspective of human life and dignity the economy matters too. Unnecessary deaths increase during recessions

    in response to Fair enough but I think even that example is a bit misleading. I think the better argument against grey isn’t to suggest the economy can be closed like the Louvre with little consequences, but to point out that death hurts the economy too and the countries who have lockdown hardest have had less overall economic impact

    So, my opinion is that unnecessary deaths happen during a pandemic because the government does not prioritize its citizens as much as it prioritizes money. I hold that unnecessary deaths happen during recessions for the same reason.

    The deaths don't HAVE to happen just because the economy is weak. That is the result of choices politicians make.

  4. have you heard of Healthy Gamer GG

    no but I've heard of Heather Graham, does that count?

  5. I agree I was just saying that john seems more centrist than hank to me. Hank is younger and seems more aware of the younger generations’ critiques of capitalism

    in response to Isn’t john pretty centrist haha

    further evidence that my opinion is hardly objective.

  8. Funny joke, but you know its not "soothsaying" to give your opinion on current events and speculate on the future, right? That's all anybody expects when they ask you questions like that. Nobody actually thinks your a prophet. But for all your joking around, your education does allow you a certain amount of insight into how current trends may affect the future. And as a very-online leftist with a substantial following, people are interested in hearing such insights from you. That's all.

    in response to but you're big smart brain man, you HAVE to soothsay for us :(

    I know that's what folks are asking, but a) I often feel the underlying desire is for someone to tell them what is or isn't going to happen, b) I don't really like making predictions because it often ignores that what happens depends on *what we do* and these questions often presuppose that the future is some kind of inevitability, and c) sometimes I give a jokey answer because I don't have anything useful to say about the thing I've been asked.

  10. Isn’t john pretty centrist haha

    in response to Do you think CGP Grey is open-minded enough that he could be persuaded to be pulled to the left and even be openly critical of capitalism?

    Let's be clear: both Green brothers are, in terms of ethical behavior, significantly to the left of most white men in this country, and to the left of the Democratic establishment. They are the rare instances of people trying to do "ethical capitalism" and actually sticking to the "ethical" part. Yes, they are still deeply entrenched in capitalism, but so is most of America, and, of the people entrenched in capitalism, they are more progressive and doing more good than like 95% of them.

    But, yes, they are entrenched in capitalism, quite securely.

  11. Fair enough but I think even that example is a bit misleading. I think the better argument against grey isn’t to suggest the economy can be closed like the Louvre with little consequences, but to point out that death hurts the economy too and the countries who have lockdown hardest have had less overall economic impact

    in response to The economy does matter though. I can’t say I understand why. But I defer to left wing economists

    I feel quite strongly that "letting half a million people die is bad for the economy" is an immoral position, because if it had no effect on the economy at all it would still be evil, and Grey's tendency to make that kind of argument is why I don't watch his videos anymore

  12. There are many areas in which buses are better imo

    in response to Buses are good

    logistically, sure. but in terms of rider experience, I would never, ever prefer to be on a bus when I could be on a train.

  13. Bus Trains?

    in response to Buses are good

    shut your mouth

  14. Just out of curiosity, what makes you think that Hank Green is more centrist but more pliable than John Green?

    in response to Do you think CGP Grey is open-minded enough that he could be persuaded to be pulled to the left and even be openly critical of capitalism?

    Well, as I implied, it is, to an extent, just a feeling, and you should take that with a big ol' spoonful of salt.

    Hank periodically makes videos about the need to be nice to billionaires if you want to convince them to help solve problems, or about why you shouldn't "do bad things to get good outcomes" (without wading into the consequentialist question of what our definition of "bad" is if the outcome is good), and also he took GamerGate at its word that it was mostly good people who just needed to denounce the handful of harassers. All of these seems more neolib than John's tendency to just put his head down and try to put his privilege to good use.

    But! Hank also used to be significantly more radical, and was something like an eco-leftist. So that shows a) that his position can move, and b) that there are things he clearly cares about that can be inroads. I've half-jokingly considered trying to get #RadicalizeHankGreen tending in the past. I feel like he's enough of a systems thinker that you could probably convince him of the inherent unsustainability of capitalism with the right handful of arguments. John, meanwhile, hasn't shown much sign of shifting his positions; if anything, his "put privilege to good use" has only gotten more entrenched as he's accumulated more privilege. Which is a good thing to do with privilege! But it does not show much interest in eradicating the systems that produce privilege in the first place. He hangs out with Bill Gates, you know?

    Again: like 90% of this is projection and I'm mostly analyzing John and Hank Green's public personae, which is always going to be an incomplete view of them as people. Maybe they're both stubbornly neolib! Maybe they're both leftists-in-waiting! Also I'm not actually trying to radicalize either of them, so this is nought but thought experiments!

  15. Most & least favorite Haruki Murakami works? What's your opinion on Haruki Murakami as a writer and what appeals/doesn't appeal to you?

    I've never read Murakami

  16. but you're big smart brain man, you HAVE to soothsay for us :(

    in response to Are companies producing environmentally friendly products/implementing environmental-protection policies going to be enough to protect them when the now inevitable runaway global warming brings dire consequences for the planet? And which country would you put money on being the first to start spraying stuff into the atmosphere to increase albedo and delay further warming? I would have said the USA ten years ago but then China started ramping up it's climate mitigation stuff and has not stopped ramping, so i figure they just go for it one day and dare anyone to do more than complain about it Not counting Gates and his literal trial balloon here by the way, i mean a sustained effort to reflect sunlight from the atmosphere before we lose all the existing sources of it at ground level

    I'm sorry, I've failed you

  17. Do you think CGP Grey is open-minded enough that he could be persuaded to be pulled to the left and even be openly critical of capitalism?

    Assessments of CGP Grey's political pliability would be pure conjecture, I'm afraid. More autobiographical 'tubers, like the Green brothers, I can make a somewhat more informed estimate (i.e. I think Hank is more centrist than John but also more pliable), but even that is pretty parasocial. I've got bits and pieces of a person through a filtered, unidirectional medium and that leaves me a lot of room to fill in gaps with projection. Grey puts very little of himself in his videos, barring the bits of ourselves we cannot help but put in our work, which are often obvious to friends but inscrutable to strangers.

    As it stands, it's possible Grey can be moved left, but I'm not in a position to move him, so it's moot from where I'm standing.

  20. The economy does matter though. I can’t say I understand why. But I defer to left wing economists

    in response to (Different anon) I'm assuming you're talking about the amazon thing for Grey? Or has he said something else bad?

    You mistake my meaning! The economy being a product of the government doesn't mean it doesn't matter, you are correct. But lots of things matter. The Louvre matters. But if there was a chance The Louvre would kill 500,000 people in 2020 you'd be a douche not to close it for a while.

  21. Are companies producing environmentally friendly products/implementing environmental-protection policies going to be enough to protect them when the now inevitable runaway global warming brings dire consequences for the planet?

    And which country would you put money on being the first to start spraying stuff into the atmosphere to increase albedo and delay further warming? I would have said the USA ten years ago but then China started ramping up it's climate mitigation stuff and has not stopped ramping, so i figure they just go for it one day and dare anyone to do more than complain about it

    Not counting Gates and his literal trial balloon here by the way, i mean a sustained effort to reflect sunlight from the atmosphere before we lose all the existing sources of it at ground level

    in response to Are companies producing environmentally friendly products/implementing environmental-protection policies the first ethical steps towards solving climate change?

    I wish I could tell you the future, friend, I really do, but I'm afraid that power was not bestowed upon me.

  22. What do you think of books in general?

    in response to What do you think of the book?

    oh, they're frickin' GREAT, friend! if you haven't had the pleasure you gotta get on it. cannot recommend enough.

  23. (Different anon) I'm assuming you're talking about the amazon thing for Grey? Or has he said something else bad?

    in response to Are there any aspects of Grey’s “Rules for Rulers” videos that you don’t like, or feel don’t cover the subjects presented by the source material in a satisfactory fashion?

    I've answered this before, but I can't seem to dig it up and CC has no real search options, so I have no choice but to answer again!

    Grey has never done anything I find outright *offensive* but his politics are irksomely neoliberal in the rare event he explicitly wades into them. He's pretty good when he's talking in abstracts, like how different voting systems work in a vacuum, but he very carefully does not comment on WHY flawed systems persist, who benefits from them, or the ideologies that make them appear moral. And his Takes from Nowhere have landed badly for me several times now.

    Obviously his video defending the royal family was pretty effectively taken down by Shaun, which makes me second-guess a lot of his authoritative statements. And his general "technology can solve traffic congestion!" opinions are irritatingly myopic ("we don't need to address the ways that prioritizing profit and efficiency caused this problem, we just need a profitable and efficient solution!"). But I got a ways into his lockdown video where he says that governments weighing the risk to life of the coronavirus against the threat to the economy of a lockdown and trying to find a happy medium was reasonable and had to turn him off. I just can't with that bullshit. The idea that "the economy" is some separate entity from the government that has to be managed as opposed to a construct that we can fucking well suspend to save lives is just... ugh.

    And, I get it, I had the same neoliberal brain worms once upon a time, and back then Grey would have seemed very reasonable to me. I just don't have the patience for it anymore.

  24. Any thoughts on schools that offer foriegn language classes offering sign language classes as if also foriegn language?

    I don't have a policy suggestions, if that's what you mean, but if my school had offered ASL I would've definitely taken it.

  25. Would you consider that all highways be removed or financially penalize drivers for traffic congestion?

    Not sure! My reflex is to say highways are less the problem than the number of cars, and replacing cars with cheap mass transit is preferable to simply removing highways or penalizing drivers. But I have in no way investigated alternatives to car culture, and what strikes me as a good idea on first blush may not prove the most effective means of treating the problem.

  28. Are companies producing environmentally friendly products/implementing environmental-protection policies the first ethical steps towards solving climate change?

    I'm afraid every one of those companies is hoping it's the LAST step they have to take.

  29. What celebrity do you dislike the most?

    that's a very negative question!

  30. (Different anon) Runoff voting is good, but it alone won't destroy the two-party system. Runoff voting plus multi-member districts, like they have in Ireland, will. The key to ending a two-party system is some kind of multi-member element ensuring that one person doesn't have to represent everyone in a district, not runoffs.

    in response to Why don't elected representatives represent their constituents (outside of outright cheating like gerrymandering), and how can we effectively make them?

    Yes, something like that. I confess I was speaking briefly - "campaign finance reform" is also functioning as a kind of metonym for a far larger and more complex process.

  31. Are there any aspects of Grey’s “Rules for Rulers” videos that you don’t like, or feel don’t cover the subjects presented by the source material in a satisfactory fashion?

    I never finished Grey's Rules for Rulers. I have the book it's based on, and am annoyed with Grey's politics often enough that I'd rather get it from the horse's mouth, y'know?

  32. Why don't elected representatives represent their constituents (outside of outright cheating like gerrymandering), and how can we effectively make them?

    because voters aren't their only constituents. they also have loyalties to their party and their donors. we need to adopt something like runoff voting to break up the two-party system and massively overhaul campaign finance to decrease the influence of money in politics.

    (and, like, end capitalism, but one thing at a time.)

  36. Different anon but case in point the Johnny Depp Amber Heard legal situation seems thorny

    in response to So less "convict on the story alone" and more "treat the story as grounds to even gather evidence at all"?

    I haven't been following it, but the speed with which people forgot all the damning evidence against Depp as soon as there was a counternarrative really gets to me. They may prove correct that Heard was the abuser, but good lord were people eager to believe it.

  37. So less "convict on the story alone" and more "treat the story as grounds to even gather evidence at all"?

    in response to How do we strike a balance between “always believe victims” and “wait for the evidence”?

    sure, though in most cases you wouldn't be the one gathering evidence. just... treat the situation as serious and treat the accuser as innocent of lying or manipulating unless proven otherwise.

    also, from my experience: require substantive evidence before saying the accuser is lying. I see people willing to flip on the entire #MeToo movement as soon as anything fishy comes out about a single accuser, and seem to immediately forget all the evidence they've already provided. again, not saying they won't turn out to be liars, just treat that as a significant claim that would require significant evidence.

  39. This implies that your metamour can transform into a vehicle, and is in fact therefore a transformer

    So which vehicle is it, Mr Studios, if that IS your real name?

    in response to What vehicle does Metamour transform into?

    WHICH METAMOUR

  40. What smartphone feature would you actually be excited for a company to implement?

    a replaceable battery

  41. My dad is a cop :( how to solve

    I'm your new dad

  43. How do we strike a balance between “always believe victims” and “wait for the evidence”?

    they are not in conflict with each other. "believe victims" doesn't mean victims are never wrong or lying; it means "victim stories are reliable such a large percentage of the time that you should always treat accusations as plausible and take them seriously."

  44. What “old person” things do you do?

    grunt when sitting up

  45. Even though Tony Stark is a filthy billionaire capitalist, do you consider him a compelling character?

    I consider the Tony Stark of Iron Man 1, The Avengers, Iron Man 3, and Spider-Man: Homecoming has a really compelling arc that has some interesting stuff to say about the nature of power. It is, unfortunately, repeatedly undermined and retconned by all the other movies.

  46. you ever play stardew valley?

    If so, villager you like best?

    I've never played Stardew for the same reason I've never done ecstacy

  48. You regularly advocates for our current economic system to be abolished while openly admitting you don't know what you'd replace it with which, whether you realize it or not, invites the assumption that you don't think it matters. How is it dishonest to point that out?

    in response to Is that hyperbole? Or do you actually want to shatter our current economic system with zero regard for repercussions...

    can I ask you how it invites that assumption? is there any other area of your life where you apply this logic? if someone says "I don't want a pizza party for my birthday, but I haven't decided what I want to do instead yet," do you say "ok cool so I guess they're fine having their party in a ditch"?

  49. Is there a better term for a romantic partner than bf/gf/so, they all feel weirdly euphamistic to me or just verbose

    p...partner?

  50. Metamour is a Transformers robot, right?

    in response to In line with what you're saying, there's a Jewish teaching that says, "It is contingent upon us to do the work to make the world a better place, but it is not expected or demanded that we be the ones to finish it. While you are not required to complete the work though, nor should you turn your face away from it." Basically, do all the good you can, care for people, the environment, plant trees and spread kindness. Work to protest injustice and change laws. But, if that doesn't all get fixed in your lifetime, that's fine. Change doesn't happen in a night. Do everything you can and take pride in that. And if your actions along with others are the ones that change the world, then even better. And never ignore that there is a problem or injustice that needs to be worked on. I feel like a lot of online leftists, and honestly most people in this country, could benefit from this teaching.

    I wish!

  51. Explain why NFTs are the root of all evil, again? I need to use this to explain to a friend.

    capitalism is premised on scarcity of resources. digital media has no scarcity. NFTs are an attempt to artificially create scarcity in digital art.

    I don't pretend to understand how it works but that's why I think it's trash.

  52. My brother really hopes this is true and not an April Fools answer. He's an Iron Man 3 fan. :)

    in response to What’s your favorite holiday movie?

    This is not a bit, my partner and I watch Iron Man 3 on Christmas ever year.

  53. Can you recommend any reading or video essays on (conservative) hierarchy from an egalitarian perspective? I'm already reading the Reactionary Mind.

    Sure! https://theauthoritarians.org/

  54. you can be angry and have fun at the same time

    getting people to involve themselves in the work long-term means making protest and (especially) direct action fun, because it's mentally exhausting to be constantly and exclusively pissed off

    in response to I'll add (unwarranted, no-one gives a shit about my opinion) that if you are unsure, big demonstrations and protests are ABOUT telling each other and the wider public about what you can do and who they are, community stuff is key, you aren't alone but making you feel alone is a growth industry for the opposition And as an actual question, whats the most fun you had a protest?

    I recognize it's possible, but I find anger a deeply unpleasant emotion and it's hard for me to feel good when I'm pissed. That's a personal thing and I know it's not how everyone feels.

    I suppose the counterprotest in Boston right after Charlottesville, where the Alt-Right was trying to repeat their efforts there but we came out in the thousands, most of them canceled, and it ended up being about 50 conservatives hiding from 10,000 protestors is the best I've felt at a protest. It was also really well-organized, with tons of activist groups taking the mic, explaining EXACTLY what they do and giving you numbers you could text right then to join a mailing list, and train de-escalators to make sure violence didn't erupt (who had to spend more time managing cops than fascists). That's how I want protests to go.

  55. Your what now?

    in response to In line with what you're saying, there's a Jewish teaching that says, "It is contingent upon us to do the work to make the world a better place, but it is not expected or demanded that we be the ones to finish it. While you are not required to complete the work though, nor should you turn your face away from it." Basically, do all the good you can, care for people, the environment, plant trees and spread kindness. Work to protest injustice and change laws. But, if that doesn't all get fixed in your lifetime, that's fine. Change doesn't happen in a night. Do everything you can and take pride in that. And if your actions along with others are the ones that change the world, then even better. And never ignore that there is a problem or injustice that needs to be worked on. I feel like a lot of online leftists, and honestly most people in this country, could benefit from this teaching.

    my metamour

  56. God help me, I like Scott Pilgrim (the movie/game/comics, DEFINITELY not the character as a person).

    that movie is a barrel of fun!

  57. haha men are shit haha seeing this sentiment constantly parroted in leftist spaces isn't doing good things for my chronically low self-esteem haha but it doesn't matter because i'm a man and therefore a member of the oppressor class haha

    in response to What do ya think The First Bigot was like?

    Hey friend, it seems like you're reading more into my statement than is there. I've mentioned several times Samuel R. Delany's observation that, of all bigotries, misogyny is the oldest, and I agree with him. So, yes, the first bigotry was man against woman. There is no statement here about how many men were bigots, or any claim that misogyny is somehow congenital to men, or that you have no choice but to be an oppressor. I get that hearing comments on toxic masculinity can make a man, especially one grappling with his own feelings about himself, feel personally criticized, but acknowledging that there is a longstanding system of benefiting men isn't a statement on you in specific.

    It is repeated in leftist spaces for the simple fact that it is true and must be acknowledged. But I'm a man who does his best not to participate in toxic masculinity, so obviously I don't believe every man is toxic.

  58. In line with what you're saying, there's a Jewish teaching that says, "It is contingent upon us to do the work to make the world a better place, but it is not expected or demanded that we be the ones to finish it. While you are not required to complete the work though, nor should you turn your face away from it."
    Basically, do all the good you can, care for people, the environment, plant trees and spread kindness. Work to protest injustice and change laws. But, if that doesn't all get fixed in your lifetime, that's fine. Change doesn't happen in a night. Do everything you can and take pride in that. And if your actions along with others are the ones that change the world, then even better. And never ignore that there is a problem or injustice that needs to be worked on.
    I feel like a lot of online leftists, and honestly most people in this country, could benefit from this teaching.

    in response to Within the last 2 years, I started becoming more involved in politics and with the help of online resources and videos like your Alt-Right Playbook series, moved left. I find myself becoming discouraged with the amount of left infighting on Twitter. Now of course, I know Twitter is just a social media platform, but it is where I engage the most in left-leaning ideas/discussion. How do you stay hopeful or optimistic with all of the hostility? (Not saying that some of this hostility isn't warranted sometimes, but it does get discouraging still.)

    my metamour has that tattooed on his arm in Hebrew

  59. How about Bears?

    in response to cats?

    even less inclined to clearcut the rainforest

    humans really are unique on this front

  60. I'll add (unwarranted, no-one gives a shit about my opinion) that if you are unsure, big demonstrations and protests are ABOUT telling each other and the wider public about what you can do and who they are, community stuff is key, you aren't alone but making you feel alone is a growth industry for the opposition

    And as an actual question, whats the most fun you had a protest?

    in response to I understand if you don't want to answer this one, left infighting about practice being what it is, but what would you recommend people actually do? Twitter is ass, so obviously not more Twitter, but is it joining an org? Making an affinity group? Talking to your neighbors, or your coworkers? Protest? Breaking shit? Volunteerism? Running for office? Ecoterrorism? Any of the above? (please say ecoterrorism)

    that's what a GOOD protest is, but I've been to plenty of crap protests that have a lot of folks talking passionately about the need to "get involved" and "push issues" but offering nothing actionable except going to the next crap protest

    I have never had fun at a protest. I go to protests when I'm angry.

  61. What do ya think The First Bigot was like?

    dunno, but I know it was a man

  62. I understand if you don't want to answer this one, left infighting about practice being what it is, but what would you recommend people actually do? Twitter is ass, so obviously not more Twitter, but is it joining an org? Making an affinity group? Talking to your neighbors, or your coworkers? Protest? Breaking shit? Volunteerism? Running for office? Ecoterrorism? Any of the above?

    (please say ecoterrorism)

    in response to Within the last 2 years, I started becoming more involved in politics and with the help of online resources and videos like your Alt-Right Playbook series, moved left. I find myself becoming discouraged with the amount of left infighting on Twitter. Now of course, I know Twitter is just a social media platform, but it is where I engage the most in left-leaning ideas/discussion. How do you stay hopeful or optimistic with all of the hostility? (Not saying that some of this hostility isn't warranted sometimes, but it does get discouraging still.)

    any of those can be valid. I'd suggest picking an issue that matters to you and drilling down on it. the best way to deal with climate change is different from the best way to deal with police brutality which is different from the best way to deal with wealth redistribution. pick something your passionate about and look into who's dealing with it and how, and either follow in their footsteps or join them.

  63. once again, it's me, the anon which you talked to about racism towards white people. I'd like to just say that I'm extremely disappointed in you as a creator and a person for leaving me hanging and not answering. extremely disrespectful to invalidate my experiences by not having a conversation.

    have a good one

    thanks, you too

  64. Different OP but wait. What happen to Shane? He did something nasty?

    in response to Alex Garland or Shane Carruth?

    not a lot of specifics are out, but his wife claims he was abusive and has a restraining order against him, and he tweeted a photo that surreptitiously had the restraining order in the background which read as a quite invitation to harassment

  66. Within the last 2 years, I started becoming more involved in politics and with the help of online resources and videos like your Alt-Right Playbook series, moved left.

    I find myself becoming discouraged with the amount of left infighting on Twitter. Now of course, I know Twitter is just a social media platform, but it is where I engage the most in left-leaning ideas/discussion. How do you stay hopeful or optimistic with all of the hostility? (Not saying that some of this hostility isn't warranted sometimes, but it does get discouraging still.)

    well, simplest answer is I spend a lot less time on Twitter

    more complex answer is I no longer require political optimism. I don't know if we're gonna win. I don't know if we're gonna fix things. I don't know if it's already too late. but I believe we should do the right things regardless. either we turn things around, or we at least make things a little better for folks on our way towards extinction; in either case, what else can you do but try?

  67. Alex Garland or Shane Carruth?

    as an artist, Carruth, by a country mile. but Carruth appears to be a much, much worse human.

  68. Worst Polygon

    heptagon

    be a hexagon or an octagon! what's wrong with you?!

  69. What’s your favorite holiday movie?

    Iron Man 3

  70. Cats are actually an invasive species funnily enough so they very well might could. At the very least, birds and rodents would be having a hard time

    in response to cats?

    cats do not clearcut the rainforest or burn fossil fuels, fam

  71. I don't think that's a satisfying handwave, 44 million is still a LOT of people, and 5 million of that is in the US, about 2% of the eligible voting population, which is more than the margin of victory in a lot of elections in the past few decades

    in response to I'm not necessarily advicating for abolishing the voting age entirely, but it seems worth pointing out that all these arguments apply just as well to an adult w/ advanced stage Alzheimer's or certain very sever intellectual disabilities, & as far as I can tell those people at least in theory (tho maybe not in practice) still have the right to vote

    I didn't mean to imply it was satisfying, I'm just saying it's what people who don't want to think much about the issue will say

  72. I'm not necessarily advicating for abolishing the voting age entirely, but it seems worth pointing out that all these arguments apply just as well to an adult w/ advanced stage Alzheimer's or certain very sever intellectual disabilities, & as far as I can tell those people at least in theory (tho maybe not in practice) still have the right to vote

    in response to Why not just abolish the voting age entirely? And for that matter, let all current or former prisoners and non-citizens vote, too It seems to me that any restrictions on voting (except, perhaps, for a residency requirement) would be unjust, because you'd always be able to find a person who isn't allowed to vote who is more "deserving" or "qualified" than someone who is allowed

    yes, but that can be easily handwaved away:

    number of people in the world with Alzheimer's: 44 million
    number of people in the world under 18: 2.29 billion

  73. Different anon, but jf Tamir Rice is any indication, there *is* no age that a cop won't *shoot* a kid if they've got a toy gun or are walking home wearing a hoodie.

    in response to Isn't "law" just the set of rules which governs which state violence is justified and legitimate? If you accept the premise that violence against children is never justified or legitimate, then it follows fairly straightforwardly that the law should not (or in practice does not) apply to them The logically consistent voting age is the age at which society thinks it becomes okay for a cop to hit a kid

    well... there are ages where they won't shoot a WHITE kid

  74. Isn't "law" just the set of rules which governs which state violence is justified and legitimate? If you accept the premise that violence against children is never justified or legitimate, then it follows fairly straightforwardly that the law should not (or in practice does not) apply to them

    The logically consistent voting age is the age at which society thinks it becomes okay for a cop to hit a kid

    in response to Well, as I'm sure you know, minors are treated differently under the law than adults. So I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.

    *bong rip*

  75. cats?

    in response to Should dogs vote?

    cats would make us all their servants but they probably wouldn't ruin the environment

Anon commented:
Ian replied: