CuriousCat Archive Page 20 of 202

  1. (none of these anons) The idea that the creation of Israel was reparations for the Holocaust is rather odd to me, considering that AFAIK nobody in Palestine was involved in the planning or execution of the Holocaust (at the very least, not to the extent that people in Europe were).

    in response to (diff anon) I can't believe I have to say this, but the Jewish nation of Israel had *their* land taken from them by the Ottoman Empire *centuries before* the mandate for Palestine. Which was "made right" by the establishment of modern Israel as reparations for the Holocaust.

    neither did the people living on that land have any say over it becoming the new sovereign nation of the Jewish people

  2. (Orig anon) ok then where is the land of the Jewish people then?

    in response to (diff anon) I can't believe I have to say this, but the Jewish nation of Israel had *their* land taken from them by the Ottoman Empire *centuries before* the mandate for Palestine. Which was "made right" by the establishment of modern Israel as reparations for the Holocaust.

    the Jewish people have been a diaspora for millennia. and, look, if the Jews say they want a land of their own and there's a place that offers them one, or a space the world willingly vacates for them, ok. but stop fucking inventing reasons why is okay to take it from someone else by force. like what the absolute fuck is wrong with you?

  3. is the rise of transphobia as a wedge issue in US conservative issues at least in part caused by its seeming success in the UK over the years or do you think it's parallel evolution?

    it might be overstating to say "conservatives saw its success in England and adopted it for mercenary reasons," but American transphobia is DEFINITELY influenced by the UK gender criticals. Posie Parker and Graham Linehan are among the biggest names in TERFdom even here. lotta cross-pollination. (also a lot of US conservative money propping up UK TERFs, so it goes both ways.)

  4. How come human bring and immediately remember and recite every note and lyric in a song but can't remember a 9 digit phone number?!

    different parts of brain

  5. (diff anon) I can't believe I have to say this, but the Jewish nation of Israel had *their* land taken from them by the Ottoman Empire *centuries before* the mandate for Palestine. Which was "made right" by the establishment of modern Israel as reparations for the Holocaust.

    in response to Black people: We deserve a special consideration from the state for our specific heritage and policies that have our specific interests at heart! Ian: Wooow yeah! #blacklivesmatter!!!!!1111one Indiginous people: We deserve a sovereign state the is specifically for our ethnic group, that has our specific interests at heart! Ian: Wooow yeah! ##indiginouslivesmatter!!!!!!1111one Jews: We deserve a sovereign state the is specifically for our ethnic group, that has our specific interests at heart! Ian: woh woh woh there not so fast its #alllivesmatter for you guys.

    you can't just make the Palestinians pay the Ottoman Empire's reparations, JESUS FUCKING CHRIST! you REALLY don't see them as human, do you?

  6. You know you're right I can't think of a single bad thing that has ever been done to the Jewish people, who are totally all colonisers, unlike those two groups

    in response to Black people: We deserve a special consideration from the state for our specific heritage and policies that have our specific interests at heart! Ian: Wooow yeah! #blacklivesmatter!!!!!1111one Indiginous people: We deserve a sovereign state the is specifically for our ethnic group, that has our specific interests at heart! Ian: Wooow yeah! ##indiginouslivesmatter!!!!!!1111one Jews: We deserve a sovereign state the is specifically for our ethnic group, that has our specific interests at heart! Ian: woh woh woh there not so fast its #alllivesmatter for you guys.

    the essence of Zionist thinking in a nutshell: "something bad happened to us so we can take other people's land, oppress them for generations, and then bomb what's left of them." it's literally the mentality of the US after 9/11. being the victim doesn't give you carte blanche to victimize others, ya freak.

  7. I don't wanna make fun of someone taking any excuse they can to bust out a semicolon; but come on, my peer. That clearly called for a full colon and a new initial capitalization.
    i.e. "Depends: Do you use google's definition for genocide?"
    I am exhorting you: Up! Your!! Game!!!

    in response to Depends; do you use google’s definition for genocide?

    ROASTED

  8. Black people: We deserve a special consideration from the state for our specific heritage and policies that have our specific interests at heart!
    Ian: Wooow yeah! #blacklivesmatter!!!!!1111one
    Indiginous people: We deserve a sovereign state the is specifically for our ethnic group, that has our specific interests at heart!
    Ian: Wooow yeah! ##indiginouslivesmatter!!!!!!1111one
    Jews: We deserve a sovereign state the is specifically for our ethnic group, that has our specific interests at heart!
    Ian: woh woh woh there not so fast its #alllivesmatter for you guys.

    in response to (diff anon) It obviously sounds antisemitic when you call it genocide and apartheid, and I agree it is those things, but let's say I'm a hardcore zionist. How can Israel be a sovereign state for Jewish people if it can't tie citizenship to Jewishness, the logical outcome of which in unequal rights? How can it be a sovereign statw for Jewish people if it can't remove displace people to create or ensure a Jewish majority? Genocide and apartheid are NOT Jewish precepts, but they are natural extensions of any nationalism where the nation must be a specific group of people, right? How else could you totally end the genocide and apartheid without making it a secular pluralistic state? I hope this doesn't come off as a "gotcha" question, if there is a way I would like to know, and it seems like you think there obviously is one, but I don't see it

    hey fam: African Americans were taken from their homeland. indigenous people had their land taken from them. I think both deserve those thefts be made right. shocker of shockers: Palestinians had their land taken from them and Ian thinks that theft should be made right.

    stop carrying water for colonizers.

  10. (diff anon) Since you're intent on being smug about this, here you go:

    "The term “apartheid”, an Afrikaans word, derived from the French term “mettre à part”, literally translated to “separating, setting apart.” Apartheid is a policy that is founded on the idea of separating people based on racial or ethnic criteria."

    Now that you have the response you're looking for, how's about engaging with the argument that Israel's treatment of Arabs *doesn't* fit the definition of Apartheid?

    in response to Arabs aren’t legally separated within Israel’s borders though. Just because there may be some Arab communities in Israel doesn’t mean they can’t live elsewhere.

    you're arguing Israel does separate Arabs and Jews by racial and ethnic criteria?

  11. A while back you said you didn't have opinions of Nelson Mandela because you had a gap in your knowledge and now you're an authority on apartheid?

    in response to Arabs aren’t legally separated within Israel’s borders though. Just because there may be some Arab communities in Israel doesn’t mean they can’t live elsewhere.

    not an authority, no, which is why I'm asking the people declaring what is or isn't apartheid what definition they're using, and it's fascinating that none of y'all will

  12. Do you agree with this statement: not all anti-zionists are antisemitic, but virtually all antisemites are anti-zionists.

    no. there's a chunk of modern Nazis that admire Israel even though they hate Jews. it's a thing.

  13. Arabs aren’t legally separated within Israel’s borders though. Just because there may be some Arab communities in Israel doesn’t mean they can’t live elsewhere.

    in response to Why would any apartheid system openly allow the people they’re oppressing in their parliament? Isn’t that antithetical to their own interests? Unless you think Israel’s government isn’t democratic, despite all polls and studies to the contrary.

    is that definitional to apartheid? this is very easy to verify.

  14. Why would any apartheid system openly allow the people they’re oppressing in their parliament? Isn’t that antithetical to their own interests? Unless you think Israel’s government isn’t democratic, despite all polls and studies to the contrary.

    in response to There are Arabs in the Knesset. Freedom of movement and speech for all minorities, and the right to vote. Arabs go to the same schools, stores, hospitals, and ride the same transporation. There are even Arabs in the IDF. All of those, except serving the military, would have been inconceivable in apartheid South Africa or even Jim Crow.

    I dunno why don't you google the definition of apartheid

  15. There are Arabs in the Knesset. Freedom of movement and speech for all minorities, and the right to vote. Arabs go to the same schools, stores, hospitals, and ride the same transporation. There are even Arabs in the IDF. All of those, except serving the military, would have been inconceivable in apartheid South Africa or even Jim Crow.

    in response to Is Israel actually an apartheid state?

    I note you didn't give a definition of apartheid, you just argued this apartheid grants nicer privileges in lieu of rights

  17. What should I have for dinner

    jerk tofu seared and wrapped in collard leaves with crushed peanuts and a cilantro drizzle

  18. Is Israel actually an apartheid state?

    I'm curious what definition of apartheid wouldn't apply to them

  19. What do you think of Sgt. Pepper and Magical Mystery Tour?

    in response to What was their best record?

    I haven't spent a ton of time with either but they don't have as many of my favorite songs

  20. What was their best record?

    in response to What is your actual serious opinion of The Beatles?

    my heart belongs to Abbey Road even as I concede Revolver is probably the better album; if we're looking less for cohesion and more just bulk orders of good music, The White Album is the most diverse and interesting.

  21. Favorite non-Sonic Sega game you played as a kid? As an adult?

    I fuckin love NiGHTS

  22. Is Short Skirt Long Jacket an example of a manic pixie dream girl

    Short Skirt Long Jacket is a deconstruction of the Manic Pixie Dream Girl. John McCrea was deliberately describing an impossible person who meets every cutesy desire a man could have even if they require superhuman constitution (how can she get up early AND stay up late with any regularity?) or have no actual meaning but FEEL meaningful (what kind of clothes she wears).

  23. If it’s not genocide, why are so many Jews vehemently opposed to it? And are they Nazis?

    in response to I tell you you’re advocating for soft genocide of Jews and you call it Nazi shit. Tbh I think the whole trope of left wing people calling everything Nazi is BS, didn’t expect it from you

    I think even the hardcore Orthodox Jews who disallow marriage to gentiles generally stop short of calling interfaith marriage "genocide" because, you know, Jews experienced *actual* genocide and know the difference

  24. Can you make this analogy using Youtube video essays? Pretty please?

    in response to Diffanon, part of me REALLY wants to know how many analogies you can manage to make for this. Like you're prolly Done making them by now but part of me Just Wanna Know.

    No Way Home is Thundef00t's "Anita Sarkeesian is horrible" videos, and Morbius/Madame Web are Davis Aurini and Jordan Owen making an entire documentary about Anita being evil, and on that curve Thunderf00t looks pretty good but I could just watch Jacob Geller or something

  26. I will never watch this movie, and I have no doubt it fails in the execution, but - - - the US having its own super-nazi cell isn't necessarily incoherent or inaccurate. It's not like the nazis had a monopoly on nazi race nonsense.

    in response to (different anon) I'm no media analysis expert, but aren't there several YouTube videos, and in some cases books, about the subtext in MCU/Disney movies? Like, there are still people who interrogate those specific movies, even though it might be less people now than before?

    yeah but "all of the US' moral failings since 1945 were caused by the secret supernazi cell, also these nazis have no racial ideology they're the splinter group that just wanted to rule the world with glowing supermacguffins" IS incoherent

    but getting you to think "the US having a supernazi cell is plausible" and then think NO FURTHER on the topic is exactly the MCU's move

  28. (different anon) I'm no media analysis expert, but aren't there several YouTube videos, and in some cases books, about the subtext in MCU/Disney movies? Like, there are still people who interrogate those specific movies, even though it might be less people now than before?

    in response to It's elitist of me to blame marvel movies and disney writ large for eroding media engagement right? For gradually obliterating subtext and any requirement on the viewer to interrogate fiction, right?

    indeed. that said, one of my chief complaints about the MCU is that they don't hold up to much media analysis. Winter Soldier's subtext about the US' corrupted ideals falls apart with the reveal about Hydra; Iron Man 3's critique of racist caricatures being used for political ends is undone in a later movie by revealing there was a "real" Mandarin the whole time; Black Panther ends with a radical idea of revealing Wakanda to the world as a means of Black liberation but all the shit with Thanos distracts us long enough that we stop thinking about it (and has T'Challa willing to sacrifice the entire nation to protect a single white-coded robot).

    what makes MCU analysis interesting is finding the shit they didn't REALIZE they were saying in their attempt to bring up heavy topics without committing to any particular position.

  29. I tell you you’re advocating for soft genocide of Jews and you call it Nazi shit. Tbh I think the whole trope of left wing people calling everything Nazi is BS, didn’t expect it from you

    in response to So you advocate soft genocide, where Jews inevitably marry non-Jews in this secular state and the culture “evolves” (read: dies, because Judaism isn’t any more socially acceptable than Christianity and might even be less). Hard gen vs soft gen, that’s the distinction. I’m actually ok with soft gen too.

    you're arguing that race-mixing is genocide

  34. are you interested in that civil war movie coming out soon?

    I cannot tell how morbid my curiosity is, but kind of. Garland lost me with Devs, dunno if I trust him with Civil War. but, you know? one thing Garland is not is a coward. and sometimes that's enough for me to say "fuck it, let's see Civil War."

  35. What would you think if you saw someone cosplaying randomly in public?

    I would think they were living their best life

  36. (DA) Now I'm curious to know what you think the school cafeteria pizza of the MCU/superhero movies is.

    in response to Still leagues better than Madame Web or M*rbius

    in this metaphor it's No Way Home, which is better than the shitty chef's salad of Morbius

  37. Do you remember which Magnetic Fields song would be in this video?

    in response to Do you plan on making any videos about Outer Wilds and/or Disco Elysium?

    so it was actually EVERY Magnetic Fields song about the moon, and making each about the quantum moon in a different location. so something like:

    orbiting The Hourglass Twins - You and Me and the Moon
    orbiting Timber Hearth - I Have the Moon
    orbiting Brittle Hollow - The Dreaming Moon
    orbiting Giant's Deep - Save A Secret for the Moon
    orbiting Dark Bramble - Sad Little Moon

  38. Favorite Zelda minus BotW/TotK?

    I'm probably the kind of guy who would say Link to the Past or Majora's Mask if I'd completed either of them, but I haven't, so I gotta be the basic bro who says Ocarina of Time

  39. It's elitist of me to blame marvel movies and disney writ large for eroding media engagement right? For gradually obliterating subtext and any requirement on the viewer to interrogate fiction, right?

    in response to Still leagues better than Madame Web or M*rbius

    not elitist, no, but probably reductive?

  40. This analogy isn't working for me.
    Can you make a similar but different one about... I dunno, boardgames?

    I mean, take your pick, but I have an unhealthy obsession with boardgames.

    in response to Still leagues better than Madame Web or M*rbius

    people are telling you candyland is better than snakes and ladders when you're a grown-ass adult with multiple versions of settlers of cataan in your walk-in closet

  41. do you ever wonder if nuerotypical people are actually neuromostcommon

    I'm not convinced they're mostcommon

  42. So you advocate soft genocide, where Jews inevitably marry non-Jews in this secular state and the culture “evolves” (read: dies, because Judaism isn’t any more socially acceptable than Christianity and might even be less).

    Hard gen vs soft gen, that’s the distinction. I’m actually ok with soft gen too.

    in response to (diff anon) It obviously sounds antisemitic when you call it genocide and apartheid, and I agree it is those things, but let's say I'm a hardcore zionist. How can Israel be a sovereign state for Jewish people if it can't tie citizenship to Jewishness, the logical outcome of which in unequal rights? How can it be a sovereign statw for Jewish people if it can't remove displace people to create or ensure a Jewish majority? Genocide and apartheid are NOT Jewish precepts, but they are natural extensions of any nationalism where the nation must be a specific group of people, right? How else could you totally end the genocide and apartheid without making it a secular pluralistic state? I hope this doesn't come off as a "gotcha" question, if there is a way I would like to know, and it seems like you think there obviously is one, but I don't see it

    foh with this Nazi shit

  43. Still leagues better than Madame Web or M*rbius

    in response to can you post a rant here about why exactly No Way Home sucks cuz i have no intention of watching it but the points you raised in your movie thread sound very interesting

    ok so like

    school cafeteria food is all bad, but obviously pizza day is better than that bland-ass "chef's salad"

    but I'm an adult. I don't have to grade my meals on the curve of "good for cafeteria food." I eat in restaurants now! and this restaurant has served me better food before! and I don't have to eat here if the food isn't good, I can go someplace else! I don't NEED to accept flavored-cardboard pizza as better than the rest of the menu, there's REAL PIZZA right down the block!

  45. If you could snap your fingers and make any stage to film adaptation happen (with any combination of talent currently working), what would it be?

    Hadestown with Jason Webley as Hermes

  49. What is an evil character from fiction that you think you would enjoy hanging out with?

    Tim Curry in Legend

  50. (diff anon) It obviously sounds antisemitic when you call it genocide and apartheid, and I agree it is those things, but let's say I'm a hardcore zionist. How can Israel be a sovereign state for Jewish people if it can't tie citizenship to Jewishness, the logical outcome of which in unequal rights? How can it be a sovereign statw for Jewish people if it can't remove displace people to create or ensure a Jewish majority? Genocide and apartheid are NOT Jewish precepts, but they are natural extensions of any nationalism where the nation must be a specific group of people, right? How else could you totally end the genocide and apartheid without making it a secular pluralistic state? I hope this doesn't come off as a "gotcha" question, if there is a way I would like to know, and it seems like you think there obviously is one, but I don't see it

    in response to (diff anon) At first this question seemed ridiculous, you're clearly criticizing Israel's current genocidal actions in Gaza, which is different from saying Israel is "inherently" genocidal, but I think your answer is at the heart of the issue here. If Israel has to recognize the rights of its non-Jewish population, is that the same as Israel ceasing to exist? I'd say of course not, but it seems like for some, Israel fundamentally can't exist if it has to be a pluralistic secular state and isn't allowed to do aparthied things, like whatever country it would be after that could not be Israel

    I am saying Israel should become a secular pluralistic state, and rejecting the conflation of this with Israel "ceasing to exist." Israel needs to transform in the same ways most nations have had to transform away from theocracy and oppression. most still have a long way to go, but that transformation is a good thing. and it's not like the level of theocracy in Israel has remained constant throughout its history so far! Likud was not always in power. every nation evolves; every nation is a continuum.

  51. Eclipse gonna see you?

    in response to Are you gonna see the eclipse?

    similarly depends on the weather I guess

  52. Are you gonna see the eclipse?

    depends on the weather, honestly

  53. How's your recovery?

    in response to Do you have a projectile

    as with any fastfaller, probably not great, but not completely borked

  54. (diff anon) At first this question seemed ridiculous, you're clearly criticizing Israel's current genocidal actions in Gaza, which is different from saying Israel is "inherently" genocidal, but I think your answer is at the heart of the issue here. If Israel has to recognize the rights of its non-Jewish population, is that the same as Israel ceasing to exist? I'd say of course not, but it seems like for some, Israel fundamentally can't exist if it has to be a pluralistic secular state and isn't allowed to do aparthied things, like whatever country it would be after that could not be Israel

    in response to You can't argue against people saying "Israel shouldn't exist" one moment and casually call it a genocidal ethnostate the next. Because the belief that Israel is, somehow inherently, a genocidal ethnostate is exactly why so-called progressives feel free to say shouldn't exist with a clear conscience. You can't have it both ways.

    I dunno, I think it's actually deeply antisemitic to say Israel can only exist as both a genocidal apartheid AND the sovereign nation of the Jewish people. that, if it's not both, it ceases to exist. I feel I shouldn't have to say this, but genocide is not a Jewish precept? I would like to see the midrash that says otherwise.

    we can get into a philosophical conversation about whether South Africa ceased to be South Africa when apartheid ended, if the US ceased to be the US when it ended slavery. which is a nice little Ship of Theseus thought experiment. but it's pretty moot to this conversation, because the reason OP is saying "Ian thinks Israel should not exist" is they're lumping me in with the eliminationists who want the nation ERADICATED. they are trying to paint the desire for Israel to change and the desire to kill all the Jews there with the same brush.

  55. You can't argue against people saying "Israel shouldn't exist" one moment and casually call it a genocidal ethnostate the next. Because the belief that Israel is, somehow inherently, a genocidal ethnostate is exactly why so-called progressives feel free to say shouldn't exist with a clear conscience. You can't have it both ways.

    in response to (diff anon) Why are so many online progressives so focused on the semantics here? What moral imperative is there for what Netanyahu's government is doing in Gaza to be defined as genocide in specific? It seems like it's all for the gotcha of saying "The country that was founded as reparations for the Holocaust is now *doing* a Holocaust. Therefore Israel shouldn't exist actually" which I hope you realize is a clearly anti-Semitic view. Netanyahu has *literally* weaponized the generational trauma of the Jewish people in a bid for authoritarian power, and that's terrible. But it doesn't make him the second coming of Hitler, and it certainly doesn't mean Israel "shouldn't exist" by any definition.

    the fuck are you talking about? I want Israel to stop doing genocide and recognize the rights of its gentile population. it's a very straightforward demand, stop pretending there are riders on it.

  56. Well, you state that these far-right provocateurs aren't actually bigoted and are only using non-white people and LGBT people as simple props to go after white liberals (their real target) and that white liberals don't actually advocate for marginalized people and instead moral victory over the provocateur. You say that when white liberals try not to give a reaction to the provocateur, its because white liberals are more worried about moral victory than caring about minorities. My criticism is that by protesting against the provocateur, your basically giving him what he wants, a "persecution fantasy" for him to play with. But by not giving the provocateur what he wants, you diminished his power.

    in response to On one of your previous videos, "The Cost of Doing Business" you said that it was important to protest far-right figures at university campuses like Milo Yiannopoulos to protect minority groups. However I feel like this is the wrong approach. Provocateurs like Yiannopoulos and Ben Shapiro purposely use protest against him to gain credence and thus make themselves more acceptance. Protesting these people are considered "cancel culture" and "anti-free speech" among many people, and thus is used as a tool against the left. However if we ignore these people, will it make them less visible and thus protect minorities more?

    please watch the video to the end

  58. (diff anon) could you please not lump every soviet death as "russian". Soviet union consisted of a lot of countries(and the modern russia does as well) and lumping everyone together as a "russian" helps russian imperialism, because their main way of doing imperialism is by saying "there aren't any Ukrainians, or Belarus, or Dagestanis, or Buryats. They are all really russians." Belarus has lost 25% of their population in ww2, Ukraine lost 16%. Like, I get it, you generalized, but the more accurate way would be to say soviet. Admittedly, doesn't quite fit the argument, but still

    in response to If Israel dropped a nuke on Gaza today, would that be considered a genocide? If so, then why aren't the atomic bombings of Japan considered a genocide?

    ok

  60. On one of your previous videos, "The Cost of Doing Business" you said that it was important to protest far-right figures at university campuses like Milo Yiannopoulos to protect minority groups. However I feel like this is the wrong approach. Provocateurs like Yiannopoulos and Ben Shapiro purposely use protest against him to gain credence and thus make themselves more acceptance. Protesting these people are considered "cancel culture" and "anti-free speech" among many people, and thus is used as a tool against the left. However if we ignore these people, will it make them less visible and thus protect minorities more?

    I addressed question in the video, do you disagree with what I said?

  61. (diff anon) Why are so many online progressives so focused on the semantics here? What moral imperative is there for what Netanyahu's government is doing in Gaza to be defined as genocide in specific? It seems like it's all for the gotcha of saying "The country that was founded as reparations for the Holocaust is now *doing* a Holocaust. Therefore Israel shouldn't exist actually" which I hope you realize is a clearly anti-Semitic view.

    Netanyahu has *literally* weaponized the generational trauma of the Jewish people in a bid for authoritarian power, and that's terrible. But it doesn't make him the second coming of Hitler, and it certainly doesn't mean Israel "shouldn't exist" by any definition.

    in response to If Israel dropped a nuke on Gaza today, would that be considered a genocide? If so, then why aren't the atomic bombings of Japan considered a genocide?

    maybe a reason we spend so much time stressing the nuance of the situation is cuz folks like you come on and strip all the nuance out? I have never said "Israel should not exist" and spend a lot of time arguing with people who do. nor have I compared Netanyahu with Hitler. at the same time, Hitler (sadly) did not invent nor own the patent on genocide so pulling "how dare you compare a Jew to Hitler" anytime someone rightly calls this genocide is a cheap dodge, and claiming criticism of Israel is "antisemitic" only works if you accept the Zionist argument that Israel is synonymous with the Jewish people, which is deeply racist for two reasons: it erases all the non-Jews who live there (Israel is over 20% Muslims, Christians, and other gentiles), and it has long been used to insist Jews in other countries aren't "real citizens" because they all have divided loyalty to Israel. it's fucking shameful that people resort to the very arguments antisemites used to oppress American Jews when they need to defend the genocidal ethnostate of Israel.

    also "genocide" is a word with a meaning and this is what it means, the fuck do you want me to do about it? the main reason we "insist" on it is we use the word in its correct context and then people start complaining that we used it. sorry, but there's no ethical excuse to not call a genocide a genocide, the whole reason people are mad is they don't like the truth being spoken out loud.

  62. Do you remember when conservatives went after Obama for wearing a tan suit?

    yes. went after him for wearing jeans, too.

  63. 4chan’s /pol/ board is strongly in support of Hamas and against Israel, and it’s not because they want Palestine to be free.

    in response to Is Israel's very existence proof of horseshoe theory? Both the far-right and the far-left want Israel to stop existing, but for very different reasons.

    I... don't know what your point is? we are in agreement that a lot of the Right hates Israel, but the original argument was that the whole of both the Far Right and Far Left hate Israel, and that's not true. /pol/ is a major part of the reactionary animal, but it's only ONE part, and there are lots of reactionary groups that fucking HATE /pol/.

  64. Would China’s treatment of their Uyghur population constitute a genocide by that definition? They’re not being bombed or shot like Palestinians but their culture is being destroyed, and their population is declining from forced sterilization and abortions. I know this is probably not something you’ve researched but assuming everything I said is true, would it be a genocide?

    in response to If Israel dropped a nuke on Gaza today, would that be considered a genocide? If so, then why aren't the atomic bombings of Japan considered a genocide?

    by many definitions, yes

  65. Capitalism Bad?

    yuh

  66. Would people who voted for Biden be morally culpable for choosing someone who will likely continue supporting a genocide, or would we just be seen as "mitigating the damage?" And if we don’t vote, are we responsible for what happens next?

    in response to Is a vote for Biden a vote for genocide?

    whatever you do, you are morally culpable for what happens. vote for Trump, vote for Biden, don't vote knowing your vote could make even a tiny difference - if you have ANY agency at all, then you are culpable for what happens. that's the conundrum. everyone saying "you HAVE to vote Biden because he's better than Trump" needs to accept that they are culpable for anything Biden does, and I don't think many are willing to admit that. they WANT it to be "had no choice, it was that or Trump" so they don't feel any responsibility, and will often minimize atrocities he commits so they don't feel bad for supporting him.

  67. Are you suggesting that a "genocide" could occur without any deaths?

    That seems suspect.

    in response to If Israel dropped a nuke on Gaza today, would that be considered a genocide? If so, then why aren't the atomic bombings of Japan considered a genocide?

    then maybe this is an opportunity to question what you think the definition of genocide is, and where it comes from, and where your suspicions are founded, cuz "forced relocation of a civilian population" is part of The International Criminal Court's definition of genocide, and if you think you know better than The Hague I'ma ask you to justify that opinion

  69. Van Halen or Van Hagar?

    is that the one who begat Ishmael?

  70. Is Israel's very existence proof of horseshoe theory? Both the far-right and the far-left want Israel to stop existing, but for very different reasons.

    what? the Far Right loves Israel these days. and the Far Left are deeply divided on what the future of Israel should be. like... you understand there are a lot of Jewish socialists, right? there are comparatively few Jewish Nazis. don't get me wrong, we pinkos can be VERY reductive when talking about international politics, but you can't say "Israel should not exist" on the Left without other leftists arguing with you. hell, even some of the Nazis are like "well, I like that they're an ethnostate, and it's nice to have someplace to ship all the Jews to."

  72. I feel like saying or implying that a Biden regime will be marginally better on queer issues is just pinkwashing.

    in response to I don't feel like, as a trans person, I can vote for any Republican with the rhetoric they're gearing up about their own domestic genocide of us, regardless of what atrocities Biden is supporting. I deeply hate this is the position I feel trapped in. Am I wrong to feel this way?

    I get where you're coming from but I think that's a little simplistic. the only voices in mainstream politics working to defend trans rights are in Biden's Party. even if he were just as eliminationist towards trans people as Trump, that would make a difference. and most of the damage done to queer culture by liberals of late has been liberals treating queer folks as bargaining chips to appease conservatives; Biden just agreed to ban Pride flags in government facilities, which is evil, but the fact that he did it to make conservatives happy does matter. it doesn't make him LESS evil, but it's still important to look at where the bigotry is coming from.

    ugh, I hate saying stuff that sounds like defending Biden. Biden is fucking VILE and you're within your rights to refuse to vote for him! I'm trying to add nuance, not persuade you. everything is bullshit.

  73. (diff anon) This is actually a thing that has stumped me for a bit. My understanding has always been that Israel is and has been actively in pursuit of the genocide of the Palestinian people for decades. I'm only now realizing through these exchanges that most people seem to be more event-driven in their perspective of the genocide. Not saying that's wrong (in fact, I'm coming to realize it's more correct). But perhaps my older perspective is relatively common and most people who say things like "the US has been actively supporting one genocide or another at every point in its history" comes from that place.

    in response to Dunno why you're waffling on this. Why would you think Trump isn't going to be an enthusiastic supporter of Ukrainian genocide? Heck, has there BEEN a vote for US president that HASN'T also been a vote for genocide? We're kinda always doing or supporting a genocide.

    it's true that it's hard to decide where, on the spectrum from "settlement, displacement, and oppressive violence" to "destruction of a culture and people," you should draw the line. but it's also clear that what is happening now in Palestine is a massive acceleration of that project, to a level not seen since - and arguably more complete than - the Nakba. but the prospect of "slow genocide" should maybe not be overlooked.

    most definitions of genocide in international law are more explicit about the faster kind, possibly because the slow version leaves room for the culture to repopulate and evolve (and probably because the slow version would incriminate a lot of the cultures writing the definition).

    we are butting up against the limits of my knowledge so I'll leave it at that before I stick my foot in my mouth by recommending a new area of study that has actually existed for a century.

  74. I don't feel like, as a trans person, I can vote for any Republican with the rhetoric they're gearing up about their own domestic genocide of us, regardless of what atrocities Biden is supporting. I deeply hate this is the position I feel trapped in. Am I wrong to feel this way?

    no, you and I have a similar position (though, as a cis person, it's for different reasons). I feel trapped voting for Biden as well, as I think he is probably, on balance, the lesser evil, but I don't know that I can stomach that much evil. I can't even say "a vote for Biden will make things better for trans people," cuz I can only say "if things get worse, they'll get worse slower." what a fucking joke.

  75. If you had to speedrun a game, which one would it be?

    Earthworm Jim

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